Hey, this is Tablo.
The world expects a lot from us, huh? It's turning all of us into overachievers and sometimes we just, we can't deal with it.
Back in the day, I wrote a song called "Over" that deals with this very subject. Because I grew up as an overachiever. Sometimes against my will, and at times it felt like it would

crush me.
I've lived my whole life constantly feeling like I need to outdo myself again and again. It was… unbearable.
So if you're going through something like that — in your workplace, at school, in your relationship — if you feel like you're being expected to do something that you're not capable of

doing… if you feel like it's never enough, hopefully these lyrics will help.
You got so much to prove
hopin' they approve
The only thing that's true
is all you ever do is do
You're moving shoe to shoe
but you're not going
You stop growing
the moment that you stay at the top

The only way is to drop
Free-fallin' down the stairs that you climbed up
Lined up to freely mount the air
but you dare not airdrop
Tied up like a hair knot
hikin' down without a chance of stepping on a fair rock
And so you stand still in a standstill
hands still building castles on a sandhill
"Man, chill," is what your friends say
but you're not hearin' what

little men say
Anyway
Keep on going and taste the stars
Keep on growing and raise the bar
You're livin' life for the A's down to the Z's
After the hill you got a mountain to seize
Who can tell?
Your living in an organized hell
The mansion of your mind
just an oversized cell
The pressure
Everything is

done to a measure
In the sea of competition sunk like a treasure
Like a feather falling slow
spiraling to the floor
strung up like a broken violin to your course
Opportunity is knocking at your door
but you never left a welcome mat
It doesn't matter anymore
or anyhow
but you're too late to turn back
Fate pushing you into the wall like a thumbtack

Ain't no comebacks in this game of life
Roll the dice again
Roll it once, never twice
Keep on going and taste the stars
Keep on growing and raise the bar
You're living life for the A's down to the Z's
After one drop you got a fountain to seize

If you're tired of all the pressures in life, listen to this.

Raise the Bar

Hey, it's Tablo. This MINDSET booster is for anyone who's feeling utterly hopeless.
I don't know exactly what you're going through right now. And I don't know what events are playing out in your life at the moment. But I need you to know that it is possible to find beauty and hope within tragedy.

I've had my share of tragedy. I would even say that my life has just been a series of perpetual misery, at times.
One thing that helped me was I began to see my life as a movie, and myself as the main protagonist of that movie.
And, this movie is not the genre that I'd like it to be.

It's not a romantic comedy. It's not this uplifting biopic, with a great, inspiring score.
And at times, this movie feels like a horror film. It sometimes feels like a suspense film, where the suspense just drags on and on.
But, the minute I start seeing myself in this movie,

I know that even my pain or the suffering that I'm feeling right now can become something enlightening for someone else. That it can become something that is beautiful.
Just as when we watch a movie, we look at somebody that is breaking down, or somebody that is dealing with something… incomprehensible… we can see them as heroes.

That's how I started seeing my life at times, and it helped me get through the moments, and onto the next scene, and onto the next scene, and allowed me to not have "the end" pop-up.
I always got to the next day, and I always got to the next year, and there were many, many sequels.
So, I don't know if this is going to work for you like it worked for me, but…

just try. To move onto the next scene.
I know this scene is heartbreaking. I know this scene that you're in right now feels like it's dragging on. But, I need you to try to move on to the next scene.
And that requires you to sit through this one.
Please know that it's a necessary scene to get to the ending that you want.

Listen to this when life feels unbearable.

When You're Feeling Hopeless

Hey. This is Tablo, and you have entered my Mindset.

I have no idea what this is going to be. This is new to me as well. And I'm usually not used to having people in my mind.

Despite what I may appear to be

like onstage or on the screen, I am a fairly private person, and I like to keep my mind closed off. So this is uncharted territory for me as well.

I don't know what brought you here honestly. Maybe you heard a song of mine? I have countless songs. My team Epik High has been around for… way, way too long.

And we have many, many albums. So maybe a song you heard, maybe a lyric of mine, brought you here.

Maybe it was something I wrote? I wrote a couple books. I write crazy things on Twitter all the time, so maybe you read something and that brought you here.

Or maybe you saw me on TV. I had a reality show with my daughter that was very popular.

I've also been on the news a lot. Sometimes for things

I didn't do. And sometimes for very unfortunate things, so maybe that intrigued you and brought you here.

Whatever the reason, I hope that your stay inside my Mindset is a rewarding one.

Let me just say this: I don't want you to walk out of my mind having learned more about me. I'm hoping that the experiences, and the thoughts that I'll share here, and the emotions that I'll share here

will help you walk out of here knowing more about yourself. And, if possible, liking yourself a little more.

So my rap name, the name you know me by, is Tablo: T-A-B-L-O.

Before I got this name, I was simply Daniel. Or Dan, or Danny… whatever my friends chose to call

me.

Before that I was Seon-woong Lee.

So I've had many names in my life. And, Tablo is the one that I didn't expect would be the one to stay with me forever.

And many people wonder like, "What is the meaning of Tablo? Is it like from the French word tableau? Like, an artsy name?"

And honestly, I know how I got this name, but I don't know

if it was intended to mean anything.

The first time I was able to rap on a song — and the song was actually going to come out, for like the mass audience — so I needed a rap name. And, I got a call and they're like, "You need to decide your rap name tonight."

I didn't know what to do. I didn't want to go with "Daniel". That would be a pretty bad name for a rapper.

So,

I was with a friend and his girlfriend at a coffee shop very late at night.

And I was like, "Okay they need a name, like, I need a name. What name do I go with?"

And my friend's girlfriend was like, "You like art, right? You love art. You always go to like, art galleries and stuff."

And I'm like, "Yeah."

And she's like, "So maybe like, I don't know, Pablo. Like, Pablo Picasso."

And I'm like, "Okay that's… stupid. I don't want to

be Pablo Picasso."

And she's like, "Then change it a little bit. Maybe like, I don't know, change the P to a T. Tablo."

And I'm like, "I love that!"

And that's it. I became Tablo.

So this Mindset, Tablo's Mindset, is going to be fun. It's going to be hilarious at times. It's going to be substantial. You're going to dive with me into some topics

that honestly may not be comfortable for me. But, I know that sometimes that's required to get to a brighter place.

So we're about to start this but, before we begin, I just need to say like, it's amazing to me that I'm here… still here, and able to do this. To speak with you guys. And I'm thankful that you're listening.

Crazy things have happened in my life. Ever since I, I was born basically. So, I-I'm actually shocked that I'm still around. And feel very blessed for each day I get, for each moment I get.

There are some dark corners of my life, of my mind, that I'm going to have to enter. There are certain doors that I've

fought for years not to open. And I have a feeling that… we're going to have to open some of these.

But I'm hoping at, at the end of it all, if it helps you deal with the crazy things in your life, if it helps you get from today to tomorrow, and to the next day and to the next day, if it helps you survive…

then I'll open any door.

So, I'm ready. Are you?

This is Tablo. Welcome to my Mindset.

Meet Tablo

[This episode contains content that may be disturbing.]

Episode One: I'm Still Alive.

When you've been in the game for this long, when you've had a successful career for almost two decades, usually the question people ask you is like, "How did you, how did you make it? Like, what was the

formula? Like do you remember when you first made it? How did it feel? Like, did you have these ambitions growing up?"

Strangely enough, the question I get the most from other people is, "Dude, how did you survive that? Like how did you not let it crush you? How are you still alive?"

And… that's what I'm trying to get at. Like there is a very public event that happened in my life,

that some of you will be familiar with, where I had to deal with a great misfortune, in real time, in front of millions of eyes.

And I think the only reason I was able to survive it is because I had spent a lifetime dealing with various, different misfortunes and

learning to deal with overwhelming emotions.

I don't want to make myself sound like super old or anything. I would say I'm still young but, I've lived quite a bit of life. So it's extremely difficult for me to try to capture like an entire lifetime in, into any words.

But my life, like anyone's life —

like your life — is made up of memories.

Unfortunately for me, the first memory I have as a kid is being completely alone.

My father was working in construction and his work took him overseas. So I rarely got to see him. And my mom is a hair stylist, so

she had to go to work very early. Every day, I would wake up and she'd be gone.

Those are my first memories that come to mind.

And then eventually I went to a boarding school in Canada, and this was when I was like 13. I was actually the only member of my family in the country. My brother and my sister, they were off in college, in the States. My mom and dad had returned to Korea.

And the boarding school I was at was exactly what you would imagine a very lonely and heartbreaking place to look like. And because I was the only one in Canada from my family, the memories I have are like me standing alone in the courtyard during a weekend where all the kids had returned home. So like, Thanksgiving… Christmas.

There was also a housemaster that was super racist, and would always find some way to make me feel like I'm not worth anything. Always singling me out, always picking on me.

It was not that great.

I think I gravitated towards things that would make me feel less alone. And at the

time… books. I read a lot. You know I learned to find characters that I identified with. I became a huge fan of music, movies, anything that would make me feel like… I'm not alone?

And I think as a result, I-I learned to understand

human emotions, really well.

And despite all the things that I do, from music, to writing, dabbling in acting — the only skill I actually have is recognizing an emotion in someone. When someone is sad, when someone is broken, when someone is alone.

For me it's like looking into a mirror, honestly.

Fast forward a few years, a memory that comes to mind is freshman year in college, summer break, one of my best friends from high school, he had a brain tumor and was in the hospital. And I wanted to obviously be there.

But being a

student and not having that much money, I had to take a series of transferring flights to get there? And when I arrived, I had arrived a little too late.

So, I got to the hospital and I was only able to see his corpse.

That was my first up-close experience with death,

and also regret. For not having been able to speak to him for the last time. And also just not being there for him.

Again, skip forward. I am now a musician in Korea… a successful one at that… feeling like nothing could go wrong. Met the love of my life, and we had a beautiful baby.

And I felt like, finally I had achieved happiness.

But the day that she was born, I was at the hospital, I went on Twitter to announce to my followers that my daughter is in the world now, and I was very happy. But the responses were completely unexpected.

Instead of, "Congratulations! Oh my God like, she must be beautiful!" I got replies,

just, people calling me a fraud. Some wishing death upon me. And I thought that was really weird. That was really weird.

But apparently, this strange… witch hunt...

Oh my God, this is really hard for me to describe this event.

I don't know. These are just things

hard, that are hard for me to talk about.

Like it's just, really complicated.

You know, I'm supposed to make people understand something that like, even people don't understand now. Like they don't understand how this event happened.

Jesus Christ…

Okay, okay.

Apparently something had been brewing online. And I was about to become the center of the biggest witch hunt in the history of Korea.

This was 2010, and a large group of people online had come up with a very complicated and complex theory,

describing how I had doctored my entire life. That I was a fraud, that I had never gone to the college I went to, and that my entire family was a fraud.

What started online quickly grew into something that came offline. There were protests in the streets, believe it or not. People

pretending to be with the government coming to my mom's hair salon. She obviously had to shut it down. My brother lost his job immediately.

And for the next two and a half years, I had to fight every single day, in real time, all televised on the news, to prove… that I am who I am.

As a result of this witch hunt, I lost things that are irreplaceable. My family lost jobs. I lost my job for a while. And my dad who had overcome cancer, fell ill again as a result and…

and passed away during this.

I remember the last night that I saw my dad, and it was in the emergency room. I was in the waiting room, and on TV, the people that had taken part in this, some of these people were going to jail.

And that was supposed to

be a moment of closure for me but… my dad was in a bed. You know, passing away. So, pretty depressing huh?

These are some of the defining moments of my life, like the defining memories that come to mind when I close my eyes and try to build a picture, the highlight reel of my life. And unfortunately, my defining moments

are moments… where I wanted to die.

I did not want to wake up the next day. I did not want to be alive.

But these dark moments, these heavy moments, don't do justice to the beautiful memories I also have. The brilliant, you know, memories that are so beautiful that they make me cry

for a different reason, for a good reason.

And interestingly, the most beautiful memories I have also come from these horrible memories that I just mentioned.

For example like, childhood. Back to when my dad was off in some other country and I, you know, I had to grow up without him, like, the most, the happiest moments I had was when he would return

from these work trips. And he always brought a gift. And he bought me this tiny like, music box? And I remember like, you know, winding it up and playing it.

And I don't know if that's the first time I fell in love with music or sound, but I, I can't forget about that moment. Like I, that moment is just with me.

Also when my friend passed away, for the first time after high school, most of my high school friends had gathered. And it was in Boston. That night we all stayed over at my friend's house, because he was living with his mom and his mom would have to be alone that night. And we all decided that we would stay there and, you know,

be with her.

So, all of us gathered in the living room and, you know we just had sleeping bags and stuff, and all of us were together.

And that night we actually, like when his mom fell asleep, we took the keys to her car. And all of us in our pj's just crammed into the car and like, went for a drive.

I know this is not the thing to do, not the right thing to do, but it was

our way of dealing with it as well.

And… we actually got pulled over by the police and we had to go to the police station. And my, my friend's mom, she came, she had to come to the police station. What a horrible day, right? Her son just passed away, and she has to go to the police station to… to get her son's friends out. Because they basically stole her car.

And we felt so

bad and we were 100 percent sure she would be super mad, but instead she just, she took us to a diner, she like, she was just happy that we were there. And for some reason that night was just one of the most beautiful moments of my life.

And also with this… this whole Stanford scandal, this witch hunt that happened to

me, obviously that, that entire period of time was difficult for me. And it was, it was more difficult because like I said, I had just had a baby, you know?

My, my wife and I, it was the first time we were being parents and anybody that's a parent knows that the first couple years are the hardest. Right? You need to constantly be there for your baby.

And though I was home because I was now not able to work, and I was also not able to go outside, honestly. If I would go to a restaurant or if I would walk around in the streets, literally people would come up and say horrible things to me. So it was just not safe for us to be out.

So, even though I was at home for the first couple years of my, my baby's

life… I was not mentally there. So obviously my wife was having a very, very hard time, basically just raising our kid on her own. Even though I was there.

And I remember I tried my best not to show emotion at home? Because I, I felt like if I let myself shed like one tear, I would just

completely destroy myself? Or I would completely crumble? And I also didn't want to, you know, burden my wife, or show my wife that I was weak. And I was weak.

And this one time, my wife and I were eating dinner together at home. And I had dazed off and my mind was somewhere really bad, even though I was sitting right there. And I guess my wife recognized that.

And she actually slammed the spoon down and she was like, "If you're hurting, just, I want you to cry. Like I, it's, I want you to know that it's okay to cry." Like, she actually wanted me to cry.

And just hearing that made me bawl my eyes out. But I remember it, it was so liberating. And, I was so thankful that I had met someone that was this strong, that could be strong enough for the

both of us.

This is something that I love about her that seriously dwarfs everything else. Like it just, nothing else really matters. And throughout that entire experience, though I had lost so much, I was able to learn how much I had gained too.

You know? I, I was able to know that I met the right person for me. And also, you know, able to fight something together.

Like when does life offer you the chance to really do that? To, to fight for survival together?

So yeah like, ironically, if I think about it, all of my best memories, all of my most beautiful memories, all the memories that I would actually fit into a highlight reel — come from my worst memories. And I think it's because I didn't let

those moments, those dark moments, become my last moment.

And I know that there are still like countless dark moments waiting for me ahead. But I also know that I'm going to rack up a ton of beautiful memories as well. And some of those moments are going to come out of these dark moments. And for that reason alone, I need to stay alive.

That is why, to this day

I am still alive.

I know that many of you that are listening right now are also going through something… just, incredibly bad. Something that paralyzes you. That makes you not want to be alive.

And I'm not trying to say that it's easy. But, I want you to

know that you need to wake up tomorrow. Because some great moments are waiting for you right around the bend. Right on the next page. Right in the next scene.

But this requires you to be here for it. For you to wake up tomorrow.

You need to see it.

We need to see it.

We all deserve to see it.

This is my

This episode contains content about death that may be disturbing. Please listen with emotional caution.

Don't let your darkest moments overshadow your brightest ones.

I'm Still Alive

This is Episode Two. I'm going to talk about Epik High, and the creative process. Ooh…
[🎵 Rain Again Tomorrow by Epik High]
Because I'm a musician and I have somehow ended up being one for most of my life, music is the easiest topic for me to talk about.
But

because it's the most comfortable thing for me to talk about, it's also sometimes kind of boring for me to discuss it.
Interestingly, I'm actually more into things that make me feel uncomfortable. Like things I don't know about, things I, I lack knowledge in. Subjects or topics that I'm unfamiliar with. Sometimes ideas that go against

mine? Or whatever I imagined my ideas to be at the time? And that discomfort propels a lot of my creativity.
And at one point in my life, music was a very, very uncomfortable space for me to be in.
I grew up being a writer. I went to Stanford, I studied literature, I was already a creative

writer that had written poetry, that had written short stories, was working on a novel. I had some screenplays and even a play that I wrote. So, I felt like I was already a fairly accomplished writer.
And one of my biggest passions growing up was film. Like I wanted to be a filmmaker, I wanted to be a movie director. And I had planned out this thing in my

mind where I would come out of Stanford and go into filmmaking.
And this one summer, during college, I was in New York and I had somehow landed like, you know I, I, my title was A.D., but it was basically like a, like an unpaid internship. And it was a documentary film. And it required me to, honestly just run to get coffee a lot.

But this is how much I wanted to be a filmmaker, I wanted to build experience. And strangely enough, this is where I was sort of first discovered. Because this one person that was investing in that documentary film was a guy in Korea, and he was a very wealthy businessman, and he had a huge record label in Korea.

And he saw me, you know, always around and he would see me during breaks where I would like, have headphones on and I'd be like mumbling to myself.
And he's like, "What are you listening to?"
And I'm like, "My music."
And he's like, "You make music?"
And I'm like, "Not really, but that's sort of like my hobby."
[🎵 Rain Again Tomorrow by Epik High]
See 'cause at Stanford I had grown to love music, and I

started like this… really, kind of crappy underground hip hop group.
Honestly, it was not a space that I felt comfortable in. It was not something that I was good at at the time. I was actually horrible I think? But the thing is, it, it… it was a challenge, you know? Like, writing rap was something completely new, and I wasn't that great. Like,

yeah and it, it made me afraid when I, when I would rap. Like somebody, if somebody would call me out and say like, you know, "You suck!"
Anyways, that was my hobby. Because it was something that provided discomfort and forced me to learn new things.
Back to this film set. This rich dude is like, "Let me listen."
He heard, and he's like, "This is actually pretty good, do you want to be a musician

in Korea?"
And I'm like, "Not really. I want to be a filmmaker."
Fast forward a couple years, I was about to finish school, and I was like, "Hey, remember like that dude thought that I could become a musician?" And I was like, maybe I'll just like give it a shot.
Like at, at this time I had gotten pretty good at rapping. And I was like, this, you know I enjoy when I'm on stage, I enjoy when I'm writing raps, I enjoy when I'm writing songs.

Maybe I can like, take a shot at this.
And I was like, maybe I'll just do it for like a couple years, and then if it doesn't work out — or even if it does work out — I'll go back into filmmaking. I'll become a film director. Or, or, I don't know… write a novel, or something.
And so, I kind of slipped in, to what became my calling.
I met Mithra. I met Tukutz. We hit it off. Became a team.

Named ourselves Epik High. We debuted with our first album. It took us about more than a year to get the album out because the first label we were at, basically you know, they were, they like… were bad people. And we had a lot of trouble getting our first album out.
We eventually did. Didn't do as well as we wished it did. And…

struggled through the second album. And with the third album, we had a song called "Fly," and that song became our first hit. And you know that, that, that's what happened with Epik High.
[🎵 Rain Again Tomorrow by Epik High]
And all this time, it's not like I was like, "Oh my God, I'm gonna create

these awesome albums and once I make it, I'm gonna like, continue to do music forever."
No. Like, I didn't even know that this was becoming a calling. Like I don't even know when it stopped being a hobby and became a calling.
And I think that's what happens with like, what you're supposed to do in life. I think sometimes it just, it, you just slip into it. You know? Like, I know there are certain people that put their mind

to it and go into it and they make it, and that's amazing. But I never for one moment imagined that I would become a rapper, and that that would be my job for decades.
I know that some of you that are listening right now want a life in the arts. I get tweets from you guys all the time, I get like DM's, emails.

I know that one of the big questions you guys have is, "How do I become an artist? Like, how do I become a good artist?"
For me, it's really hard to teach someone how to be an artist because there's no set way. But one thing that I do feel is important, and was of the utmost importance to me, is that I think

growing up I learned to recognize certain emotions in certain moments.
All throughout my life, I felt complex emotions, sometimes emotions that overwhelmed me. And some of these emotions like, if I didn't get them out, I felt like they would either destroy me or just… eat me alive, honestly.
And to

understand what I was feeling or what I was going through, I had to write it down, or I had to record it. And the thing is, I never did it to, to show someone. Like that wasn't the primary goal.
The reason why I had to do this was I needed to, I needed to see it. I needed to see what I was feeling. I needed to put into form like, this intangible thing that was going on inside me. And I needed to see it on paper, I needed to

hear it in a song, I needed to see it on a screen.
And in the process I, I kind of just ended up being an artist. Like, once what I recorded or wrote down like, got good and people were drawn to it, I think it became art and made me an artist.
[🎵 Rain Again Tomorrow by Epik High]

So if this was like a lecture, or like a college course, or like an online course or something, and I'm trying to, you know, tell you guys how to become an artist — my first answer is, like I said, it's impossible to teach someone to become an artist. Only you can do that.
But a lot of times we are scared

of our emotions? Or embarrassed of our emotions? And honestly, because they're, they're hard to understand. And the un-understandable, the incomprehensible, is usually the source of our biggest fears.
But, I think it's very important for you to constantly face new emotions? And when you do recognize that you're feeling something

new, or complicated, or even frightening at times, I think you really need to be there for that emotion. You can't run away from it. Because if you don't feel that emotion to the fullest, it's going to be impossible for you to describe it to someone else.
And I think the more and more you do it, it's like practice, and you get better and better at it, in recognizing it, to the point where you'll

recognize it in someone else. I think, I think it requires practice, and it requires you to face your own emotions.
Let's say you see somebody and they're crying. They're in their most vulnerable moment. And

although you don't know what's going on inside of them, you don't know what emotion is making them cry, or what events are going on in their lives — you're going to feel something when you see this, right?
And for you to be able to recognize that vulnerability, that pain or that sadness or that loneliness, and also… the strange

beauty of that moment as well… capturing that is a necessary first step. If you can't do this, you can't go to any other steps.
Of course you can create beautiful things. You can create like, awesome looking things, or awesome sounding things without doing this? But even though it's, it would, it will be technically great, like… ultimately it will be soulless.

And I think any great art that withstands the test of time has something in there that has nothing to do with how technically awesome it is. Like even if it's poorly made, there are things that are, that like, transcend everything. You know? Transcend its, its weaknesses or its ineptitudes. I think that is the soul of art.

And you need to be able to capture that.
And let me tell you though, this is a hard way to create. Because you need to wait until something compels you. And nothing will compel you more than a true human emotion.
You know it's like holding a fishing rod and just waiting a long time. And that may make you less prolific. It may tire you out. But, there is

nothing more important than that substance. And it takes patience.
That is why Epik High's albums are so spaced out with the releases because, unless I'm able to really capture something that compels me to create, I won't.

I really, really, really want anybody that aspires to be an artist — please don't put yourself in safe, safe, safe situations and spaces all the time. I mean, it's important for a person to, to feel safe, but you have to let yourself be exposed to people who disagree with you. People you disagree with, opinions and views that you just

cannot understand, that make you feel sometimes just totally uncomfortable. Because uncomfortable situations or spaces are ripe with compelling moments.
And that is why I'm not afraid of facing people that, you know, some people would say are haters, or some people would say are like critics. I'm constantly

following or listening to people that I honestly may not even like, and that make me feel bad at times.
Because just like you need to travel to new places to learn about new things and new people, you need to allow yourself and allow your emotions to be tested. Because nothing will compel you more

than situations like that, so that you can feel something new all the time.
By the way, at the time that I'm recording this, we are putting our finishing touches on our tenth full-length album. And apparently that's a big deal, like, that number 10. It's not like we only have 10 albums, we've actually released almost 20 albums. But this is like,

the tenth like, full body of work.
And like, a lot of people wonder how we don't run out of things to say. They're like, "How do you still have things to say? That's amazing."
And I'm like, "It's not amazing, that's just grueling work."
Because, yeah you got to, like I was saying, you got to be compelled to say something. And if you already have like a huge body of work behind you,

you know it's, it's working against you every time you create, right? So, it's really hard to come up with something new to say when you've already said so much.
So Epik High together, the three of us, need to constantly put ourselves into situations where we experience something new together. And let me tell you, it's like, it's like a married couple that's been together for like 20 years. Really

hard to experience something, like, mind-blowingly new.
You're in your routines. You, you already automatically know what the other person is thinking in certain situations, or how that person will react?
Like if something happens, I know that Tukutz is going to react with either anger, or rage, or just like, explicit whatever.
And then Mithra will probably just

be, you know, sort of like unfazed, borderline super lazy, like, like a, like a teddy bear just sitting there.
And… yeah like, we all know how each of us will react in certain situations. And, and that's bad for art. And that's bad for what we do. Because then you start just recycling things and just, you know, recreating things you've already done.

And we don't want that.
So, how we defeat that is, especially on tours, like when we are in new cities, in places we have never been to before, we will force ourselves to go out and try something new.
Like for example we… in Texas, there's this like a place where you can do like, robotic rodeo? Okay? And so you put coins in and you sit on

it like, like a merry-go-round, but it's like the rodeo? And don't ask me why we did this at like one in the morning, but I'm like, "We got to, I mean it's there, across from our hotel. We got to go there and do that."
So we went there and did it, and we were pretty drunk so, like, we were falling off, probably getting hurt. But anyways, this is a bad example, but what I'm saying is,

we try our best to constantly experience new things. And I think that's the only way we have stayed together for so long. Like, otherwise we would have been divorced a long time ago. We do fun things together, like a married couple. Like we try new things.
We're like a married couple if, um… if it was three Korean dudes.

I just want to take this moment to thank our fans because, it's actually very scary as each year passes? You know like, it's like, like a prized fighter that is, that is aging? You know it's not, it's not an easy thing to deal with.
And you don't know how afraid I, I get sometimes. Like, thinking about like, "How much

longer am I going to be able to do this?" Because it's not up to me. Like, whether or not people accept me, and whether or not people need what I create, totally determines my fate.
And with each new year, like when everyone is celebrating the end of a year — especially like last year was pretty bad — so, everyone's excited at the beginning of a new year. For me, with each new year I am also

very scared.
Because I'm, every year I'm like, "Is this going to be the last year that I, I get to do this, at the level that I get to, that I'm doing it at now? Will the fans still be there? Like will the audience still be there?"
Every show that I do as time passes, I'm afraid that I'll walk out on stage and the big crowd won't be there.
But the fact that our fans have been together with us for so long, it's amazing

because we literally are living a whole lifetime together.
But that's something that's really hard to do. Like I said, I'm married to two Korean dudes. And I know it's not easy to stick with somebody despite their flaws or despite their faults. And I know that you guys are doing that with us even though we're not like, amazing dancers, and we're not like, constantly, you know awesome, and we're not

super good looking. Two of us are dads, and like, all three of us are married, and like… you know what I mean?
So it's like, you guys are pretty awesome for sticking with us and for being there in the audience, for existing, because that is seriously the number one reason we are compelled to create or we are even able to create at all.
So, thank you for listening, thank you for being there.

On behalf of Mithra and Tukutz as well. We are constantly grateful.
This episode was called "Epik High," but I didn't want it to just be about us. Although I was talking about the creative process and art, that's not only what I'm talking about. Even if you're not a creative, even if that's not what you want to do — whatever you do, you need to be compelled to do it.
And I want everyone to feel like

they have found their calling. Even if it's not something like grand or something that you always dreamed of doing, I want you to be able to love what you do.
And to do that you need to find, even if it's tiny, you need to find something that compels you to do what you do. Whether it's in your job, your profession, your school, or

if you find somebody that you love — if you can find that thing that compels you, I know that it'll make your life better.
This is my MINDSET.

If you want to love what you do, find something that compels you.

Epik High

[A listener note: if you or someone you know is struggling with thoughts of suicide, the American National Suicide Prevention Lifeline is +1-800-273-8255.]

This episode is about processing what takes place inside your inner world. It's about navigating your own mind and your own soul. This is Episode Three.

[🎵 Lesson 4 (Tablo's World) by Epik High]

From 2002 to 2003, I worked on my debut album, Epik High's first album, "Map of the Human Soul." The reason why this album had this title was that from the first song to the last song, I tried to focus on what goes on

inside a human being's inner world.

And the reason why I did this was there was a lot going on inside my inner world. I was dealing with depression, for the first time? And by first time, I mean like, I was aware of it for the first time in my life, when I was working on this album because, a year before I finished school and decided to do music,

I was diagnosed like officially with a condition.

And, and this was a, this was a revelation to me as well. Because I had lived my whole life just being me. And being me meant that sometimes you felt really horrible and sometimes you felt okay. I didn't know that there were like names for this.

But when I was at Stanford, during my last year there, some things happened to me

and I started talking to myself a little bit. I started having really, really, really dark thoughts. And I started doing things that could harm me.

And because people were concerned, and also you know like, police had to show up at certain points, they wanted me to go to the Stanford Medical Center and speak to a psychiatrist and a psychologist. And they sat down with

me, and they assessed me, and they told me that I have manic depression and other conditions. And prescribed me medication.

So this was the first time I realized that like, "Oh like, who I am… there's a term for that? Like, there's a term for what I've been feeling my whole life?"

Because I grew up in Korea. And back in the day, in Korea like, well at least in

my family… I don't think the word depression was ever used. I-I don't think that like existed.

If you were feeling like really down or something, you were just not being a part of the team. You know, you were just not, not a happy kid. Like, you were not a strong person. Or, or sometimes you were just in the wrong — like it was almost a sin to feel a certain way, you

know?

So I was diagnosed with manic depression, and app… that's bipolar disorder now?

Oh… oh that's what it is?

Okay as I'm, as I was speaking to you guys, our producer just informed me that… I didn't know that manic depression is bipolar disorder?

So, I basically lived like the last,

how many years, thinking that these are two different things? So… I would say things like, "Oh yeah I had, I had manic depression so I probably still have it, but I, I don't have bipolar disorder though." Right?

I didn't know that they were the same thing. Really, that's what we call it now?

[🎵 Slow Motion by Epik High]

But let me take you back again, back into that room at the Stanford Medical Center with the psychiatrist and the psychologist. At the time I didn't even know the difference. Honestly I was like, "Do I really need the two of you in here?" But apparently that's what you have to do if you do it the right way.

And they wondered, like, "Why did you want to die?"

And I wondered,

"Why did I want to die? Like, why did I… why did I do that? Why did, why did I try that?" Like, because I, I don't. I don't want to die. I was confused.

And the reason why I was confused that I had a condition, like, that you could name and, and that, there were like meds for it, was that… I never thought that it was weird that I was feeling that way, or that I had felt

that way for such a long time. Because there were always legitimate reasons to feel horrible.

[🎵 Slow Motion by Epik High]

During my college years, my dad was first diagnosed with cancer. And this was during summer break while I was in Korea, and it, yeah I didn't know how to react to it. I spent

a lot of time in the hospital, by his side. I had to see, I had to see someone that was always infallible in my eyes, right? At like the weakest possible states and… incredible pain.

So, that confused me a lot and

obviously I, I started feeling horrible things and just incredible fear. But there was clearly a reason for me to feel that way, right? So, it wasn't like… it wasn't something that like, I needed doctors to help me understand. I had a legitimate reason to not feel good.

Not only that, you know I was about to leave school, like I was about to

graduate. So I had, like a life ahead of me that, I didn't quite figure out yet. And I think my dad falling sick played a part in my decision to do music in Korea, so I could be here.


Anyways I, I was, I was dealing with many, many different things at the time. And because there was a concrete reason

to feel bad, I kinda dismissed it. Like, it wasn't something that I couldn't understand.

But, speaking with these doctors I realized that like, "Okay there's maybe more there." You know? Maybe I really do need to like, start looking at this as something more than just a logical emotion, or a logical reaction to the external world.

And I-I think

that's when I started like sort of paying attention to what's going on inside of me? And then I started like, looking into my inner world and trying to, trying to put names and trying to put phrases to it, so that I can understand myself better. And in the process, this album happened.

So, when this album came out, nobody really, nobody around me at least, or even like online, I-I don't remember anyone really talking about mental health? Or any of the keywords that are often discussed now in 2021?

But I think something about this album connected with a lot of people because it was just

very different from the other hip-hop albums? Like, all of K-pop was just talking about love at this point. And when these songs talked about heartbreak, it was usually because you lost someone you love, or you broke up with somebody.

And hip-hop songs were more focused on like, the external world right? Like, society and like, social ills, politics — just things you can actually like, grab, and hold, and fight.

And this album was very introspective, which was, I guess maybe a little new. And a lot of people liked it and started following Epik High for this reason. So I'm sure there was something that people identified with. But even, even though they did, these fans didn't like say things like, you know, "I was depressed, and I heard your music, and it connected with me."

But I actually realized in retrospect that, that's what the album was doing back in 2002, 2003? Because a lot of people online pointed out to me that ever since Epik High's first album, we had been discussing mental health. I-I, that's not something I was aware of even.

I just didn't know how else to create

except opening yourself up and letting out whatever demons that are there and, and just throwing it out. So, that's how I became more aware of my inner world… by sharing it with other people.

In Korea at the time, I-I don't know if it's still

true today but, at the time it was virtually impossible to talk to anybody about this. I mentioned it to my parents and they thought it was like, me being rebellious or something. Or it was just wrong or something. You know? So I, I stopped right there like, I didn't go into details the minute that happened. Because like they felt like it was… I-I, I was like breaking their heart or something.

And it wasn't like there was a place where I could go and just

get help. It, it wasn't that easy. And also my career started. Like I, I was constantly working on stuff and eventually like the album came out and I became a public figure. And once that happened, it was, I actually was not afforded the time to even think about it.

So I think maybe that's why Epik High albums have

been very dark at times? And very somber? Because literally, the page, or in front of the mic in the studio, those were the only spaces where I could really talk about it. So, I began a conversation with, with the fans basically. And, I think maybe that was

my way of dealing with it.

I'm not saying that everyone should start a career in music and start releasing albums and start rapping to deal with whatever they're going through but, I think that everyone needs to find their own way? Their own unique way? And mine was this.

That is why I have this

gratitude to my fans that may be a little more than the general gratitude that an artist has towards their audience.

I really feel like my audience helped me save my own life.

Like I feel like if that wasn't there, if they weren't there, and this opportunity

was not there for me, I don't want to imagine what may have happened. Being in a place where… literally no one can talk to you about it because they don't know what it is. So, that was how I think I dealt with it.

And honestly, I'm not sure that I'm done dealing with it. I probably am not done, done with that.

But, you know I'm, I'm a father now. Like I have a daughter that loves to laugh. And my number one job is to keep her laughing. So, I think maybe now I have a new way of dealing with it as well.

If you really look at what I did, or how I dealt with it, if you take it down to its basics… I basically just talked. Right? I just talked about what was going on inside of me with other people.

I mean, yeah, it was in music form. Yeah it was,

you know it, it was for like a mass audience. But if you really just look at the basics of it, I, I just, I just talked about how I felt. So I think it's really important to speak it out.

And if painting it is more comfortable to you than actually saying it, then that's what you need to do. And if, if dancing is your chosen way of

expressing it, then that's what you do. If cooking, if anything you do lets you feel like you're speaking about it, I think that's, that's your unique way of doing it.

I know how difficult it is when you really feel like literally no one is there to listen. And that speaking about it is

meaningless, or just futile. So I would advise that we don't stop talking about it. I'm glad that, I'm glad that now it's a time where we're more free to talk about it.

But at the same time, I'm not an expert. I'm only an expert, ah I wouldn't even say I'm an expert on myself. So, if you are going through something, please

see somebody that is qualified to speak to you about it, if you really feel like that's what you need.

And please don't just talk to like a pastor. Please see a licensed medical professional. And I don't mean just any licensed medical professional. If you go and see someone who is licensed, but you don't feel like they're a perfect match for you or they're a good match for you, you can meet another person.

But do not go to a pastor, or that uncle, or that aunt, that may give you things that sound like answers, but may have you running in circles. Because this, this is a serious matter and you need somebody that is licensed to do it. Okay?

So I wasn't

aware but, now I realize in retrospect that I had songs about suicide. There's this one song called "One," which was one of our big hits. But the strange thing is even my label didn't know what the song was actually about until we shot the music video. Because they're like, "Dude, this is what you're trying to say in the song?"

The whole song was about like someone going through

something just overwhelming and, talking about suicide, talking about how to survive. And I also had songs about, like pills, about medication.

And how I became aware that we had been doing this actually, was that a lot of our fans thanked us for saving their lives.

And I was like, "Okay, this is way more than I expected. Like, this is different." Because so many people were saying this.

And that's when I realized like, "Oh my God, like, artists and musicians here have not been talking about this enough, that it's being considered as something, something new."

And I also realized like, how much the audience needed this? Like how many kids were like, alone in their bedrooms, or somewhere like on a bus to go to school, and going through something and identified with our song. And that, that was… it was heartwarming to hear that I had helped someone, but at the

same time it was heartbreaking.

The fact that our song was number one on the charts didn't only mean that a lot of people were listening, it also meant that a lot of people were dealing with heartbreak. That was a very profound realization for me. And I think that's when I also realized that, just as I had saved their lives, they were saving mine.

Because they were allowing me to talk about it as well.

I, I think that was a defining moment in my career and, that was when I realized, sort of my calling and what I needed to continue to do. And it, it was less about the spotlight, it was less about the charts, it was less about, you know it, it — my art had a purpose now.

One thing that comforts me is that when we were talking about these issues in our music, it, it wasn't a commonplace thing. But now the baton has been passed over and many other artists — not as many as I'd like — but at least way more than before are

talking about these things directly to their fans, and encouraging them to love themselves, and to examine their inner world, and to have strength, and faith.

I'm glad that that is happening. When I made "Map of the Human Soul," I didn't imagine that it would have that kind of impact? So, I-I'm glad that it's continuing to

happen through these other great musicians who have been influenced by it as well. So… awesome.

It's been 18 years since that first album, and I am continuing to examine my inner world? So, honestly the journey never stops.

You would think that I would have figured it out by now but I believe that I will continue to figure things out,

for the rest of my life.

This is my MINDSET.

This episode contains content regarding depression and suicide. If you or someone you know is in need of help, the American National Suicide Prevention Lifeline is +1-800-273-8255.

Don't be afraid to talk about what's taking place inside your inner world.

Map of the Human Soul

Episode Four: Life is a Movie.
If you're able to consider your life as a movie, where you're the main protagonist of the story, you'll find a lot more humor in every situation. It'll help you to stay sane.
I think my strongest armor in

life, my biggest shield, is my ability to laugh at myself. I am constantly trolling myself. And because I've mastered the art of laughing at myself and finding the humor in literally any situation, I'm able to laugh at things that happen to me.
Even if

they're heartbreaking moments, I'm able to find some humor in there.
And, I don't remember the first time I laughed at myself. I think… I think it was boarding school in Canada. So, eight people shared a room. We had four bunk beds, and this one space, it was just one space. And all of us were living in that one room.
And

the eight of us were all different. We all came from different countries, we all liked different things, and we're these young kids, right? We're like 13.
And this one night, I was playing some Korean music, and this other kid there kind of made fun of it, and then like took out the cassette tape, threw it out the window. I threw all of his stuff out the window. We went

outside. We started like, having a fist fight. It was raining.
I-I don't, I'm not like condoning any of this or like recommending it but, both of us were bloody. And the rain was falling and like just, you know like blood in my eyes almost.
And… I just started laughing.
Up until that point, I had felt like this dude was being super

racist. Because this was not the first time that this happened, where he would make fun of my music or something, which happened to be in Korean.
But for some reason, like us being in the rain, and fighting over this, and being bloody? And it being dark and just miserable, and the rain just… mixed up with the blood on my face. I don't know I just started

laughing. I just thought it was really funny. And stupid.
I know that sounds really weird, but I think I almost imagined that there was like, a 35-millimeter camera, and that we were in some, some movie about a very English-style, like British-style boarding school. And these two kids fighting

it out.
But we're fighting over like, K-pop. Like '90s K-pop.
And I thought, you know how funny would that be? Like where the stakes seem really high, but it, the reveal is that the stakes are very low. I'm not saying that that's the first time I laughed at myself but that is a, a memory and, I think that's what, that's what's happened.
Like, my group

members, Mithra and Tukutz, really find it odd that I don't panic too much. When something just goes off the rails, I immediately start joking about it or laughing out loud. Like literally laughing out loud.
And then I get to trying to solve the problem. But, it requires me to

first laugh about it.
And I think that's, that's how I've, I deal with things even now. Like, all throughout my life, I'm able to laugh at myself in critical situations, and that somehow gives me the strength to move on to the next step, which is solving that issue.
And if I'm not able to laugh at myself, and if I'm like completely, super serious in

situations like that? I know that it doesn't help.
And that's why like when I watch a Marvel movie, you know, they're like exchanging quips during like, possibility of extinction. And some people hate it, but I totally get it. That's exactly what I'm like.

You guys all know that I'm like a huge cinephile, right? I have been obsessed with films since I was a little, little kid. I grew up watching all the amazing films from the '80s, and then I backtracked and watched movies from like, you know like the '50s, '60s. I watched Asian films, European films, I, there

really isn't a film that I need to see that I haven't seen.
And I think that's affected how I see — or my perspective? Because I like to look at the world, or my world, as if I'm in a movie.
And I'm not saying I'm like delusional, where I think I'm like, "Oh, I'm a star." You know, I'm not crazy.
Let me give you an example. A sibling of mine was dealing with

something very troubling, and I was sitting with him in the car. Now you guys know what sibling I'm talking about, because I just said "him". But we were sitting together in the car, and he was telling me what was going on. And then he started crying, and like he was, it, I could see him breaking down.
I didn't know what to tell him, you know honestly. Like, there, I need — it was like a moment where I needed to say something to him? To help? But I couldn't come up with anything.
So I said to

him, "Dude, you know, you realize that if this moment right here, if this was a scene in a movie like, like a critical scene in a movie, and there was a, a camera over there, and this was played on a screen — I mean I understand you feel like your life sucks right now, and maybe it does — but the minute an audience can see that on the screen, you know they'll, they'll identify with you. And some of them

will find this moment beautiful, as heartbreaking as it is. And they will learn something from it, and it'll have substance, and it'll mean something, and it'll be… you know, it'll be worth it."
And he's like, "What the hell are you talking about?"
[🎵 No More Christmas by Epik High]
But that's

sort of how I like to see things. And here's the thing — a lot of the protagonists that we fall in love with, a lot of the protagonists that look, you know amazing in our eyes that we like to glamorize — if we actually saw them in the real world, we wouldn't think that way. There would be no glamor.
Many of those

protagonists, or heroes even, are broken people. Are people dealing with things we never ever want to imagine having to deal with. But the fact that they are the main character in their own story allows us to see them in a way where we sympathize with them, we, we feel for them, and sometimes they become

heroes.
And there's nothing heroic about what they're going through. Except that they're human, and we're able to observe it. Right? That's all they are, they're just human. And the best characters in the best films are great simply because they are very human. Not superhuman, but super human.
And all of us are like that, if you think about it. There's

not a single person on earth that fails to be human. The minute we start thinking about ourselves as main characters in a film, if we imagine that there's a camera right there, and it's going to be on a screen, and, and we're a part of this story — even if that story is heartbreaking, even if that story is frightening… it's still a work of art that will affect

people. That, that will have meaning and value.
That has helped me in many, many situations. You know I-I'll, I'll be in the moment and not being able to deal with it, and then I'll take myself out of my body, look at what's going on, laugh a little bit, and then re-enter and solve the situation.

[🎵 No More Christmas by Epik High]
You know when, when, when you hear the phrase like, "Life is a movie," everyone imagines like, a beautiful like, glamorous like sunset, and like Hollywood happy ending, everything, right?
But that's not what movies are.
How many genres are

there in movies? There's horror films. There's suspense. There's mystery. There's like drama that just… is super dramatic. There are biopics that are usually not very rosy.
How many genres of film can you name that are like, super just happy? Like family films? Like, do you guys all just watch family films and like happy

films? Probably not. And I, I love dark comedy, and, and many of these horror films and suspense films also have humor in them as well.
So, films deal with a range of different things. So just because your film, just because your life as a film, or as a movie, is not

one with constant happy endings, is not a romantic comedy… doesn't mean it's any less of a work of art. It doesn't mean that it's any less of a film.
Because right now what you're going through feels like a horror film — and we can all identify with that because last year was literally a horror film, for 365 days — just because it feels like that now, doesn't

mean that it can't flip into another genre very soon.
But even if it doesn't flip, into like, a rosier genre? It doesn't mean it has less value. It doesn't mean that it has less merit.
I guess all of this rambling, I'm trying to say this one thing:

when you look at pain, when you look at suffering, when you look at heartbreak… through a 35-millimeter lens, on a screen with a score, with some popcorn in your hands? Somehow… all of that looks beautiful. All of that looks enlightening.
And, I know that life is not a movie.

I know that it's not some fictional story. I know that your life most often feels like a documentary. But, but if, if it's, if we try to look at it in the way I described, maybe the things we're going through right now is a necessary scene in that movie.
Maybe it's this

scene where the character develops into the person or the hero that they're supposed to develop into. And we can't have any great ending without this scene.
So if you're in that scene right now, please stick around for the next scene.

And don't put "the end" too easily.
We all want to see the sequel.
This is my MINDSET.

You're the main protagonist in your own, beautiful story.

Tablo

Meet Tablo

I'm Still Alive

Epik High

Map of the Human Soul

Life is a Movie

Don't. Get. Screwed. Over.

We're All Complicated

My Team

Stars Fall. Make A Wish

21 Questions with Tablo

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